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RusskiCanadian23
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 1104
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada/Âàíêóâåð, Áðèòàíñêàÿ Êîëóìáèÿ, Êàíàäà
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 Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 1:39 am Post subject: |
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| jo jo 7 wrote: | Did everybody fall off the freaken plant?...  |
Beg your pardon? 
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Surfguy,
As far as Stalin, all I am going to say is this: on the day Stalin died, my grandparents came home (my father told me this), and my grandmother was crying, as were thousands of other women, weeping in the streets, and my grandfather was pale, and he just said: 'I have lost my father today, the Soviet nation lost it's father'.
You know how many people came out in the streets for the funeral: at least tens of thousands!
He really was missed, surfey, and I believe that was not without a good reason. He did, after all, turn the USSR into an industrial, and military Superpower. His leadership brought us Victory in the Great Patriotic War. No, Stalin's tough, hard-line leadership was indeed responcible for many Soviet achievements, and victories. He would not let the country fall apart, like Gorbachev did: under Stalin, the Banderovtzi nationalists in Ukraine, and the so-called Forest Brothers in the Baltic States were stomped into the ground by the Red Army! Stalin had the USSR acquire a nuclera arsenal of it's own, so that America, or anyone else for that matter, could never again threaten our country, and the well being, and security, of the Soviet people!
Stalin, and that is why I respect him, never cared what foreign press said of him, and what foreign governments thought about his policies. Hell, he never even went to Switzerland, Australia, or wherever else the Presidents of today's Russia can't wait to go every fucking summer and every Christmas! He was a true Patriot!
He knew what the people wanted. He saw how some peasants had very little, while others (the Kulaks) had a lot. He realised that most people thought that this was unfair. So he unleashed a campaign of terror on the Kulaks, persecuted them, until there were none left. It was a gruesome act, but a necessary one. It also helped in that the government could now cheaply feed our stroops in Great Patriotic War, without having to bargain for the products: they just got them from the collective farms (kolhoses)!
Stalin, he was more then a president, or a prime minister. He really was a father, a shepherd, a Sun in the sky above the Kremlin. I am not kidding, that is what I heard from people who lived during his reign: he was like a God! He was worshipped! When there was a big problem, the people knew: "Kamrade Stalin will take care of it. He will know what to do. He always does!". Unfortunately, there was the insane belief that Iosif Vissarionovich will always be there, steering the Soviet nation away from any trouble, leading it as he did. He couldn't off course, he was not immortal, he was just human.
In the eyes of the people, however, he was not human, he was above humanity. He was an Idol. How can any foreign propaganda ever dispute that? |
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jo-jo-7
Just Starting
Joined: 16 Mar 2010
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 1:56 am Post subject: |
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| Russki, I was wondering where everybody went lately, nobody is posting anything.... |
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surfguy
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 6979
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:00 am Post subject: |
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| Ruskii...you very well may be correct...but the fact remains though that he killed millions of russian citizensAnd it would be easy for me to accept that he did what was in the best interest of Russia and the USSR...but let me remind you...No US president has been responsible for killing as many of our own citizens as Stalin was responsible for killing in the USSR. This is my point and it is a fact. Other than this I am not here to debate. WWII or his being loved or what ever. I do know this...the USSR came out of WWII a much bigger place...Poland, East Germany, Yugoslavia, Estonia...and gosh the list just goes on...what other country had annexed so much territory after WWII? And for what...all those lives wasted...only to have the whole system collapse 50 years later...it is absurd! Was stalin a great leader...In my opinion No he wasn't. But this is just my opinion and I can only compare him to other historical leaders. You being Russian and having lived there it is for you to decide...remember too our lives are different and it is only until now that Americans are actually able to see Russia for what it truly is or was. |
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bswaminathan
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 164
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:16 am Post subject: |
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Do u think Clinton will wage a war and kill in numerous people and use of deadly chemicals in his regime. perhaps he might use UN appropriately and impose tough sanctions, how Bush did in korea, that military dictator got some ransom and asked to lift all sanctions and things are now settled.
Only Bush family waged more wars, his father destroyed Iraq peace. Son erased it from the map. Clinton, I don't think will be so barbaric.
regarding oil, you can explore alternate fuels like bio and solar. you can recommend projects and allocate more budget and tax cut for these projects, naturally it will shift away, USA is highly vulnerable, it depend on oil heavily, if you take even Asia and Russia, public transport is more preferred. Also now there is a increase in use of electric vehicles, even in space vehicles people started to explore plasma, electrical & nuclear propulsion. Even i do have a HONDA bike i still use public transport for long haul and its good we can avoid traffic and pollution and its economical too with lot of time saved. |
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bswaminathan
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 164
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:25 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Ruskii...you very well may be correct...but the fact remains though that he killed millions of russian citizensAnd it would be easy for me to accept that he did what was in the best interest of Russia and the USSR...but let me remind you...No US president has been responsible for killing as many of our own citizens as Stalin was responsible for killing in the USSR. |
Well! there are 2 things to be counted. When you say, 'own citizen', it should mean to original inhabitants not the immigrants. One way, if stalin doesn't react in that way then USSR might by doomed in his period itself. On contrary i would say, when there is a military coup in USSR during 1991-1993, there were lot of protesters, they want the system not to be reversed, a small group also contributed to the collapse, if yelstin simply fired some rounds of his cannon, then might be USSR is saved. The coup is not like to claim power but to protect a country, which is a valid reason. In this i can say stalin protected the country but yelstin is unable to.. This can be a crude comparison and justification but if its going to protect the country, then its worth to consider. |
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StephenB.
VIP
Joined: 18 Aug 2007
Posts: 807
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| Rimski wrote: | We always speak about the brutality of Stalin but most people forget that if communism raised in Russia it's because of the extreme poverty of the russian people under the tyrrany of the Tsars. This is the tyranny of the Tsars that led Russia to communism.
Under the monarchy, the Tsar was the chief of The Church. The Church helped the Tsars to maintain their oppressive power. We should not forget that The russian Church was in complicity with the tyranny during centuries. Priest, monks and nuns were not innocent. They have contributed to the tyranny.
If Stalin did something right, it's the dynamiting of the cathedral Of Christ the Saviour en 1931 (december 5th). And today the Russian Church doesn't recognize its faults. They have canonized Nicolas II. Great! If the communists did something right, it's also the execution of the Romanov. I say, well done!
Under communism, one can regret the lack of freedom but the Romanov, priests, monks and nuns are certainly not to regret. |
One has to remember that it was called Holy Russia for a reason...majority of monks and nuns were from the poor class of Russian society not all were wealthy or from pretigious families. True it was a theocratic society...remember too..if it wasn't for the czars and czarinas of Russian past..the size of Russia would be the size of Texas and Alaska...that's it. Also, many monks and nuns foought the Poles from advancing into the heartland of Russia...Remember the story of the Kazan Icon and the Tatars? Communism turned the people against the church and the intelliginsta population in Russia...it wiped out religion, artists, composers, doctors, etc...It was the Romanovs who gave the serfs their freedom...they also contributed to different charities throughout the Russian Empire and brought ideas, artists, the arts and created many museums in Russia. Russia would have been better off with a monarchy gov't in the 20th century than what it was given...How can anyone believe that communism is better for Russia today?? Do you want to go back to waiting on line for everything? Listen, you didn't even have freedom to travel around your own country during communism. At least during the Czar's times...people would make pilgrimages all around Russia; Valaam, Optina, Sergey Posad, Raifa, Glinsk, Pskov Caves etc...Even a serf who didn't like their owner would run away and could find freedom. Communist times..hmmmm Lenin's tomb...that was your pilgrimage...Then again you worshiped the antichrist called, Stalin...what do you know? Oh yeah, it was the Russian Church that held the Russian immigrant communities in Harbin, China and then in the Americas. You wouldn't know that because you were stuck in Russia being spoon fed a bunch of crap by your gov't. |
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bswaminathan
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 164
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:01 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Russia would have been better off with a monarchy gov't in the 20th century than what it was given...How can anyone believe that communism is better for Russia today?? Do you want to go back to waiting on line for everything? Listen, you didn't even have freedom to travel around your own country during communism. |
Its not a debate if communism or capitalism is better. Even if there is a transition it should be smooth. If you want to bring in a change it should be a very slow process and see to that it was well applied and accepted.
Russia was basically tuned to communism and its no bad in that. Do u think capitalism gives everything. In your country can u fly a aircraft without having a license, that too even can you test it. you need to have a license even to ride a bike. its we can say semi communism.
| Quote: | | Do you want to go back to waiting on line for everything? |
Do you want to be hungry like now or you want to wait for something you are sure to get.
| Quote: | | you didn't even have freedom to travel around your own country during communism. |
They are not going to prevent you from going out, but there is a system to check it. If you are hungry for 2days and will you prefer to go out for leisure or you prefer to quench yourself first.
for ex: when the world's 1st supersonic civil aircraft designed by russia codenamed 'concordeski' by NATO. it made its appearance in paris airshow. like you said very few russians have the oportunity to participate in that. In reality when concordeski made its appearence, there is a european jet trying to photograph it illegally, then the russian aircraft want to avoid it and it crashed. like this the west always wants to bring out secrets by using 007 or sex spies and russia wants to protect it, its basically a information security. its basically their inner govt structure and it has its own limitations. |
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StephenB.
VIP
Joined: 18 Aug 2007
Posts: 807
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| bswaminathan wrote: | Do u think Clinton will wage a war and kill in numerous people and use of deadly chemicals in his regime. perhaps he might use UN appropriately and impose tough sanctions, how Bush did in korea, that military dictator got some ransom and asked to lift all sanctions and things are now settled.
Only Bush family waged more wars, his father destroyed Iraq peace. Son erased it from the map. Clinton, I don't think will be so barbaric.
regarding oil, you can explore alternate fuels like bio and solar. you can recommend projects and allocate more budget and tax cut for these projects, naturally it will shift away, USA is highly vulnerable, it depend on oil heavily, if you take even Asia and Russia, public transport is more preferred. Also now there is a increase in use of electric vehicles, even in space vehicles people started to explore plasma, electrical & nuclear propulsion. Even i do have a HONDA bike i still use public transport for long haul and its good we can avoid traffic and pollution and its economical too with lot of time saved. |
Please your country of India is the worse with public transportation, traffic and pollution...India needs to get out of the caste system and start getting their act together...Your country needs to step into the 21st century...throwing acid on women because their dowry is too low is not morally right...and your talking about America and war...your country is always in some civil war against Sikhs, Muslims, and Hindu's. |
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surfguy
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 6979
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 11:04 am Post subject: |
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| bswaminathan wrote: | Do u think Clinton will wage a war and kill in numerous people and use of deadly chemicals in his regime. perhaps he might use UN appropriately and impose tough sanctions, how Bush did in korea, that military dictator got some ransom and asked to lift all sanctions and things are now settled.
Only Bush family waged more wars, his father destroyed Iraq peace. Son erased it from the map. Clinton, I don't think will be so barbaric.
regarding oil, you can explore alternate fuels like bio and solar. you can recommend projects and allocate more budget and tax cut for these projects, naturally it will shift away, USA is highly vulnerable, it depend on oil heavily, if you take even Asia and Russia, public transport is more preferred. Also now there is a increase in use of electric vehicles, even in space vehicles people started to explore plasma, electrical & nuclear propulsion. Even i do have a HONDA bike i still use public transport for long haul and its good we can avoid traffic and pollution and its economical too with lot of time saved. |
Ok well by this statement I can see you are very ignorant of US military actions. Clinton used the US military more than any other president since WWII. Bush Sr called on our Military to stop the Kuwaiti invasion. Reagan used it in Grenada. And Bush Jr Used it in Afghanistan and in Iraq. But clinton used our military in Somalia, Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan, Bosnia, Liberia, etc etc. I know because I served in a few of these places. Anyways the USA is not heavily dependent on foreign Oil...but our Allies are and it is they who we protect and we need to look out for thier interests which ours are linked to. So pretty naive of you to sate that we need the oil...we do not. The quality of life in the USA is far greater than everywhere else because we have cities that are surrounded by suburbs and because we are not reliant on public transport...freedom and mobility is key to our quality of life and we are willing to work hard to pay for and have this. I like having my car! We learn very early on that public transport is for losers! Now living in NYC is the only exception. India is one of the dirtiest places on earth...the filth there is known world wide. Anyways stop trying to be so righteous! All your alternative fuels...come on...we know all this...but do you know what oil is really used for? It's not just a power source...everything made of plastic comes from oil....this is the real use for it...which is Why China has such a demand for it. Energy is the lesser percentage of it's use. |
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nikir
Frequent Guest
Joined: 17 Mar 2010
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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Stephen, may I suggest that you pay a little more attention to grammar and punctuation when you post.
Doing so will give you credibility.
Especially now, when you are telling two countries how to live! |
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bswaminathan
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 164
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Please your country of India is the worse with public transportation, traffic and pollution...India needs to get out of the caste system and start getting their act together...Your country needs to step into the 21st century...throwing acid on women because their dowry is too low is not morally right...and your talking about America and war...your country is always in some civil war against Sikhs, Muslims, and Hindu's. |
Did u finished....
We are talking about something and you unnecessarily bring internal matters here. Whatever you said if they are... it’s our internal issues. We will take care.. Don’t bother take care of you. Throwing fire at Indians doesn't makes any sense, I don't care
Well in response to your reply....
| Quote: | | India needs to get out of the caste system |
We have got a caste system, because INDIA is culturally diversified, we have a history even before the birth of Jesus. We don't campaign for conversion; we don't send agents for religious conversion.
you say about women in INDIA, may be very rare and not often, our women even though facing difficult times doesn't choose a different husband, our kids have only one father and mother. There is no plural here. whereas as per other culture a wife will divorce her husband just because she doesn't like his clothing and he doesn't lend his car to her and husband simply ignoring his wife and go ahead with another woman and filing for divorce with in a weeks of marriage. This sort of culture is not here. We respect women, everywhere you can see they are respected. Even me, when i was about to start an important work i will ask my mom to bless me or i will get a good word of praise from my women employee to start the work. Similarly we respect cows. Before talking about INDIA read some truth, don't follow reports from CNN or BBC they often reflect it wrongly. We are the 1st and no1 in the following...we got the best management system "Arthasastra" which was still in practice and its scripted many centuries before. Our ancient scientist "susruthar" did the first surgical operation. Whatever missile and UAV, that’s already portrayed in "Atharvana vedha", read RAMAYANA you will know what the meaning of husband and wife relationship is. Read "Mahabharatha" it will tell you how to lead a life. "Bhagawat Gita" and "Thirukural" used worldwide. We Indians have a history which no one has. Even the Kohinoor diamond in Queen's crown belongs to INDIA and still there is a legal fight going on to get it back.
About Sikhs, even though there might be clashes, we are together when it comes to whole Nation. To know more about Sikhs go to Canada.
Don't you have any fight with American blacks and African’s? Clashes are there everywhere. Our kids go to school with text books and not with gun to shoot his girl friend and teachers.
This statement is to remain you not a return shot to your abusive replies. I do have got friends from US, USSR, Uk, Egypt and etc., and till today we are linked in friendly manner.
Hey my intention is not to point at others. We are here for a friendly discussion not pointing any citizen. So far whatever be the comments I made it points to a govt and not citizens. The comments are not pertaining to a particular country.
If there is any grammar mistake, pls excuse me.... |
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MrSpice
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 14 Jul 2003
Posts: 3431
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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| jo jo 7 wrote: | | Russki, I was wondering where everybody went lately, nobody is posting anything.... |
Exactly! I am outraged. I assume that men that used to post in here went back to striking their dongs. I can only imagine what you're doing with yourself... |
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StephenB.
VIP
Joined: 18 Aug 2007
Posts: 807
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:05 pm Post subject: |
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| nikir wrote: | Stephen, may I suggest that you pay a little more attention to grammar and punctuation when you post.
Doing so will give you credibility.
Especially now, when you are telling two countries how to live! |
You're right. It was late at night when I posted, sorry about the grammar errors. I've not been on the ball in the grammar and punctuation department. |
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StephenB.
VIP
Joined: 18 Aug 2007
Posts: 807
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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| bswaminathan wrote: | | Quote: | | Please your country of India is the worse with public transportation, traffic and pollution...India needs to get out of the caste system and start getting their act together...Your country needs to step into the 21st century...throwing acid on women because their dowry is too low is not morally right...and your talking about America and war...your country is always in some civil war against Sikhs, Muslims, and Hindu's. |
Did u finished....
We are talking about something and you unnecessarily bring internal matters here. Whatever you said if they are... it’s our internal issues. We will take care.. Don’t bother take care of you. Throwing fire at Indians doesn't makes any sense, I don't care
Well in response to your reply....
| Quote: | | India needs to get out of the caste system |
We have got a caste system, because INDIA is culturally diversified, we have a history even before the birth of Jesus. We don't campaign for conversion; we don't send agents for religious conversion.
you say about women in INDIA, may be very rare and not often, our women even though facing difficult times doesn't choose a different husband, our kids have only one father and mother. There is no plural here. whereas as per other culture a wife will divorce her husband just because she doesn't like his clothing and he doesn't lend his car to her and husband simply ignoring his wife and go ahead with another woman and filing for divorce with in a weeks of marriage. This sort of culture is not here. We respect women, everywhere you can see they are respected. Even me, when i was about to start an important work i will ask my mom to bless me or i will get a good word of praise from my women employee to start the work. Similarly we respect cows. Before talking about INDIA read some truth, don't follow reports from CNN or BBC they often reflect it wrongly. We are the 1st and no1 in the following...we got the best management system "Arthasastra" which was still in practice and its scripted many centuries before. Our ancient scientist "susruthar" did the first surgical operation. Whatever missile and UAV, that’s already portrayed in "Atharvana vedha", read RAMAYANA you will know what the meaning of husband and wife relationship is. Read "Mahabharatha" it will tell you how to lead a life. "Bhagawat Gita" and "Thirukural" used worldwide. We Indians have a history which no one has. Even the Kohinoor diamond in Queen's crown belongs to INDIA and still there is a legal fight going on to get it back.
About Sikhs, even though there might be clashes, we are together when it comes to whole Nation. To know more about Sikhs go to Canada.
Don't you have any fight with American blacks and African’s? Clashes are there everywhere. Our kids go to school with text books and not with gun to shoot his girl friend and teachers.
This statement is to remain you not a return shot to your abusive replies. I do have got friends from US, USSR, Uk, Egypt and etc., and till today we are linked in friendly manner.
Hey my intention is not to point at others. We are here for a friendly discussion not pointing any citizen. So far whatever be the comments I made it points to a govt and not citizens. The comments are not pertaining to a particular country.
If there is any grammar mistake, pls excuse me.... |
BS, I do have Indian friends here in NYC who didn't have a say on who they wanted as a spouse, therefore, they are stuck in a loveless marriage due to ancient traditions that should be discontinued. I agree with you that Americans or I should say, North Americans, have a tendency to marry for the wrong reasons, thus leading into divorce. However, divorce is everywhere in the world not just the United States, but at least people have a choice on who they would like to marry. I agree with you that we are here for a friendly discussion, but you are always talking about the United States and pointing out the negative, so I turned the tables on you. We are all human and want to only point out the good in our own countries, but in reality we are all the same people looking for a sence of security for our families and some peace in the world. I've talked about Stalin because that's what we are talking about in this room. To me, Stalin was a bastard, however, to some he was their God. So, we are all going to have different views on this guy. Just stay on the topic.
Last edited by StephenB. on Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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MrSpice
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 14 Jul 2003
Posts: 3431
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| Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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| nikir wrote: | Stephen, may I suggest that you pay a little more attention to grammar and punctuation when you post.
Doing so will give you credibility.
Especially now, when you are telling two countries how to live! |
nikir - please that large carrot out of your ass and stop telling Stephen how and what to write. Stephen knows what to do. For someone living in the Bronx, he is doing quite well. |
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