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cyndy22 · Posted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 7:38 pm Post subject: The new Russian Immigrants

I am starting this thread because I am really amazed at the number of Russian, Ukrainian and other soviet republic immigrants that I see now even in hole in the wall towns like I did yesterday.

Yesterday I had to drive to Walden Pond for work which is in greater Boston. On the drive home I was a little tired so I stopped in the evening at a restaurant/sports bar in the middle of nowhere, Athol, MA. I ordered a drink in the bar and relaxed for a while. Then 5 minutes later a group of 2 young men and 2 young women came walking into the bar. I knew immeditely that they were Russian or from one or more of the former republics. Of course as soon as I heard them speak with each other, I knew this was the case. I introduced myself and asked them more about where they lived. I wondered for example if they were camp counselors and worked around this area in the summer because the bar tender told me many international young people do that each summer in this area.

I only spoke with the 2 young men as the women were sitting outside. They were very nice. Both were 21. Vladamir was from western Ukraine and Yurey from Moscow. They immigrated 3 years ago to Toronto, where they still live. They drove down from Toronto for a 4 day vacation to visit friends. So maybe I should not be so surprised but I found it so interesting to run into these young Russians in a sleepy little town that almost no one gos to. Infact Athol is a very economically depressed community that many people have left. Of course they were just visiting and later that evening were driving to see friends in Framingham, which is outside of Boston. They spoke highly of Toronto and said there was a large Russian population there.

In any event, I really enjoyed meeting them. They perked me up. We talked a little Russian. You just never know where or when you will see and meet new Russian immigrants! It's very cool. Smile

MrSpice · Lounge Wizard Joined: 14 Jul 2003 Posts: 3431

Cyndy: You should drive a bit further south. There are now more and more russians that live in Connecticut. In New Jersey, there are areas and towns where there are lots and lots of russians (mostly middle class families with children that bought houses there). Towns like Leonia, Fair Lawn are now very russian. There are russian deli stores where you can buy typical russian fare. Not to mention Brooklyn and Queens. Some areas of Brooklyn became so russian, it's hard to find people who are not russian. Say, Sheepshead Bay and Bay Ridge areas of Brooklyn were predominantly Italian just 5-7 years ago. Now you see russian signs on every corner and a lot of russian immigrants live there. There are so many russian stores and restaurants in Brooklyn now - probably more than in the center of St Petersburg.

Best of all you need no visa and it's only 3 hours away by car. Our Brighton boardwalk is a nice place to relax, especially in the eveing...

vitalsigns · Lounge Wizard Joined: 25 Dec 2004 Posts: 2784

Yes, deleted.

cyndy22 · Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 7:21 am Post subject:

It is amazing and quite wonderful that Russian communities are springing up in various parts of not only the US but other countries as well. Of course the shops etc. are especially great for Russians who prefer particular Russian foods and products and can easily communicate in Russian.

I do agree that I should make a point to visit Brighton Beach in Brooklyn and spend at least one day on the boardwalk etc. Actually I have wanted to go there for awhile. My 84 year old babushka friend from Krygstan, sorry about my spelling, who has lived in Springfield now for 5 years, LOVES to go there for bargains!

My husband, my son and myself will be in New York the second weekend of September and I think we may spend Sunday there. I agree that it is rather nice and convenient to visit a Russian community where no visa is required and airplanes or hotels! Mr. Spice, do you have any reccommendations for places to see and visit in Brighton Beach?

btw we were driving up to New Hampshire this afternoon for the weekend, and my van broke down within one hour on the MA Turnpike. Within 5 minutes there was a huge accident only one mile ahead. It took well over 2 hours to get a tow truck and 5 more hours to get home. What a night!

vitalsigns · Lounge Wizard Joined: 25 Dec 2004 Posts: 2784

Yes, deleted.

overseas_expat · VIP Joined: 11 Jan 2005 Posts: 741 Location: Moscow

vitalsigns, I can tell you it ain't easy to assimilate into a very foreign culture and struggle with a very foreign language.

I've been in Russia nearly 2 years and my Russian is totally ploha. I think I could live here the rest of my life and never be a very accomplished Russian speaker.

And much as I'd like to be more culturally assimilated, I can tell you I'll always be picked out as a foreigner and an American. Dude, there are some things that you just can't change very much one you're older. Who you are and who you've always been is what you're going to continue to be, no matter where you live.

So lighten up.

vitalsigns · Lounge Wizard Joined: 25 Dec 2004 Posts: 2784

Yes, deleted.

cyndy22 · Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 9:00 pm Post subject:

I do agree with you Vital Signs. I think immigrants from all countries need to make an effort to assimilate. I can understand why Russian communities develop since for example immigrants want to retain some of their culture with respect to language, products, churches and services, however I think immigrants likewise need to embrace if you will their adopted country and culture. Yes it is easier for younger people to assimilate. I know that once for example Russian immigran's children go to public schools, these kids quickly start speaking English more so than Russian.

I think immigrants also need to venture out of their "communities". Language is the key to that. Most of my friends who are immigrants tend to segragate themselves somewhat with people of their culture. For example we are friends with a Polish family who were former neighbors. Their son Domenik and Alex have been friends since 2 years old. They have lived here over 10 years. I think that we are the only American friends that they have outside of work relationships. On every occassion that we visit them, virtually everyone else visitning is Polish.
They will visit us but do not like to visit us if we have a party. Their two boys however seem to be much more comfortable around Americans and American culture. I remember on one occassion where we were invited to their home for a party, I brought a quiche. My friend probably did not intend to be rude but she took one look at it and said no one will eat that. They tend to be fairly rigid about the foods they eat, even the beer needs to be Polish.

MrSpice · Lounge Wizard Joined: 14 Jul 2003 Posts: 3431

Enbracing American culture and assimilation happens automatically: it really depends on the age when the person came to America (or any other country for that matter). Most people after 50 years old will never assimilate. The ones older than 40 will assimilate a little. People that came in their early 20s (like me), will asimilate somewhat but will continue to appreciate and love certain aspects of their culture and base their life on the experiences they had as child in their previous country. Childhood is what forms our life outlook, for the most part. So, the immigrant chuldren that start their conscious life in America, will be much more Americanized than those who grew up in Russia or anywhere else. There are some close-knit communities where assimilation is slower, where people go to ethnic schools and foreign language surrounds them from the day they are born. Brooklyn has many neighborhoods that come close to that for Russians (I am not talking about Brighton Beach because most people living on Brighton Beach are senior citizens that cannot and never will assimilate, but other predominantly russian areas like Bensonhurst, Midwood, Sheepshead Bay, etc.). But most russian kids that grow up even in those russified areas still speak excellent english and become Americans...

Anya · Lounge Lizard Joined: 19 Feb 2004 Posts: 157

MrSpice · Lounge Wizard Joined: 14 Jul 2003 Posts: 3431

cyndy: Regarding places to see and visit on Brighton beach, here is my advice:

1) Brighton Beach is not St Petersburg, so there's not much to see or visit there. Also, many people think that Brighton Beach is somehow representative of russians living in New York. In fact, most people you will see on the street on a weekend came from other areas of NYC and even New Jersey to buy cheap russian foods and buy vegetables. Most people living there are senior citizens.

2) Just down the main Brighton Beach Avenue from Brighton 1st to Brighton 14th street (those are cross streets). Between Brighton 1st and Brighton 2nd street you will find "International Food" - the largest russian food store in New York City. You can get in and check it out - it looks and feels like a small supermarket in Russia with New York/Odessa undertones. It is kind of funny to see some many "soviets" in one place. On the 2nd floor you can actually eat russian food at a cafe and also buy deserts and sweets (try "kartoshka" desert - one of russian favorites). The cafe at International Food is not that great, but it's OK and cheap. Walk on the Boardwalk. There are 5 restaurants on the Boardwalk. The best one is Tatiana (it's not amazing or anything, it's just the best out of the 5), but it's kind of pricey.

3) If you want to sample good russian food at a resonable cost, visit Oceanview Cafe on the corner of Brighton Beach Avenue and Brighton 3rd Street or if you want to try russian/ukrainian cousine, try Glechek on Coney Island Avenue (about 150 yards from Brighton Beach Avenue). Or, you can drtive for 5-7 minutes and try "Stolovaya Cafe" on the corner of Avenue U and East 8th Street.

4) You can just spend some time on the beach itself. It's summer after all. But it's very crowded on weekends.

cyndy22 · Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 11:29 pm Post subject:

Thanks for your tips Mr. Spice. I did not realize Brighton Beach was home to predominantly senior citizens. No wonder my babushka friend loves it so much especially with the bargains! We have not yet visited BB. However we will be in Brooklyn 2nd weekend of September. We probably only have Sunday to spend outside of seeing RedSox Yankee game in Brooklyn and fRIDAY AND sAT. Night in Manhattan.. Do you think BB makes the most sense or should we go to one of the other Russian neighborhoods? My inclination is to go to BB since it is close and historic, plus I love boardwalks!

MrSpice · Lounge Wizard Joined: 14 Jul 2003 Posts: 3431

Let me correct myself - there are lots of russian senior citizens living in the Brighton Beach area (maybe 50-60% of the population are above 50 yo), but there are quite a few younger people living there too. And many go there to shop, especially on weekends. And even more - russian and non-russian - visit on weekends to go to the beach. So, don't think it has the athmosphere of a retirement community - it does not.

I think Brighton Beach is an interesting place to visit, considering the beach, the boardwalk and the "russian" feel of the place and the fact that you have a limited amount of time.

I think it will be a memorable experience for you. You can spend 1-2 hours there (unless you want to spend more at the beach or at a restaurant which will take longer).

If you want to visit interesting areas of Brooklyn that are not russian, you can go to Carroll Gardens and Park Slope. Both have lots of restaurants and cafes and are very nice (lots of artists, writers, students and Manhattanites priced out of Manhattan live there).

cyndy22 · Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 11:46 pm Post subject:

Thank you Mr. Spice:
Brighton Beach on the weekend sounds very interesting. I look forward to finally visiting there even for a few hours! Thank you for your suggestions of places to see. I appreciate your advice. BTW Would you be interested in meeting us? Very Happy

MrSpice · Lounge Wizard Joined: 14 Jul 2003 Posts: 3431

I will be in Europe at the time you are going to be in Brooklyn. I will be in Prague, Vienna and Majorca.

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