Way to Russia Talk Lounge

lezginka · Just Starting Joined: 04 Jun 2007 Posts: 4

I just got my American citizenship and want to go back home to Russia. I am also a Russian citizen. Whats the best way to do it. I have a valid Russian travel passport (as well as the internal one), can I just use that one to go to Russia? But I heard that Russia does not recognize dual citizenship so if they find out that I am an American citizen with still RUssian passport, I am afraid they would detain me. Or should I renounce Russian citizenship and apply for Russian visa?

Whats the best way? I don't want to go to Russia and get stuck there. I am terrified of the beauracracy there and don't want to do anything wrong. How do other people in a similar situation do that?

Thank you.

Lezginka

Generation P · Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:02 am Post subject:

Russia recognizes the dual citizenship. I have a friend who has dual citizenship, and she never applies for visa when she visits Russia. So, no worries you don't have to renounce your Russian citizenship. Smile

Accorging to this article the only thing you need is a valid Russian passport:

http://stpetersburg.usconsulate.gov/citizen_dual.htm

kolobed · Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 4:15 pm Post subject:

i'm in the same boat... well, kinda different since i'm a dude and in danger of being drafted. my advice, RENOUNCE YOUR RUSSIAN CITIZENSHIP!!! that's what i'm doing. it's useless anyway.

although russia recognizes dual citizenship in it's own twisted ways, you will have to abide by their laws when you are on russian soil.

once you are on russian soil, you are no longer an american citizen, you are a russian citizen and your american passport is not worth anything. they can do anything to you and the US consulate will turn you away.

i posted a similar topic a couple of weeks ago. here's the link:
http://www.waytorussia.net/TalkLounge/viewtopic.php?t=8891

now i'll give you some quotes from a US embassy in russia:

Russian immigration and visa laws have been recently changed, and, reportedly more changes are being contemplated. The implementation of these laws has not always been transparent or predictable. In addition, Russian Immigration officials at times implement the laws and regulations governing entry and exit inconsistently

The Russian government does not recognize the standing of U.S. consular officers to intervene in visa cases.

Unless a former Russian citizen has formally renounced his or her Russian citizenship through a Russian Embassy or Consulate, he or she always risks being considered a Russian citizen and not allowed to depart on any travel document except a Russian passport.

source:
http://stpetersburg.usconsulate.gov/citizen_visas.htm

DO NOT risk it... it's not worth it. and please whatever you do, do NOT listen to any advice given by americans who are unfamiliar with russian bureaucracy or russians who refuse to acknowledge the blatant incompetence thereof...

lezginka · Just Starting Joined: 04 Jun 2007 Posts: 4

Dear Kolobed,

Thank you for your detailed response. Given my past dealing with the Russian bureaucracy and having gotten stuck there in the past I think you are totally right. The only way to travel there is to renounce the citizenship and go there as an American citizen.

I heard renouncing, however, is rather difficult and takes time. But I guess we have no choice. I also agree with Americans often do not know the realities back in Russia so I would not trust their advice.

Have you started the process of renouncing the citizenship? What do it involve and how long does it take?

Thank you again for your detailed and very helpful response.

kolobed · Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:37 pm Post subject:

i only got my US citizenship in march and immediately started researching the implication that could arise from going back as a "dual". (sonds like you're doing exactly that right now). i made my decision to renounce a few weeks ago, found out what i need to do, and now i've decided to go through my attorney for this, just to be sure that everything is done properly.

the application fee itself is $550 (non-refundable, naturally). you need to provide:

- a copy of your birth certificate
- a copy of your US passport
- proof that you do not own property in russia
- a notorized "заявление", which should basically say that you no longer wish to be a russian citizen
- proof that you do not owe any taxes (not 100% sure about this one).

there might be something else that i'm forgetting.

to find out more info, you can call the russian embassy in washington:
202-298-5700

i haven't been able to get through to talk a real person, but there is pre-recorded information available.

you should also visit this gay-ass archaic website of theirs:
http://www.russianembassy.org/

click on "consular offices" and scroll down a little. you will find a map of the US with color-coded areas. you can find a local number to your acting consulate there. i tried calling those on several occasions, but have either gotten a busy signal or nobody was picking up. i'll keep trying, i've gotten through to them in the past, so maybe you'll have better luck than me.

unfortunately, my attorney is out of the country until next monday, the 11th. so i don't know how much it will cost or how long it will take to go through her. if you'd like, i can let you know once i find more info. if you're in the chicago-land area, i can give you her info, she is amazing and she helped me out a lot in getting my status here in the US.

lezginka · Just Starting Joined: 04 Jun 2007 Posts: 4

Thank you again for the very detailed, utterly helpful post. Looks like are in similar situations. Yes, I just go my citizenship and trying to figure how to go home without getting stuck there.

Its apparent they made the renunciation rather complicated. Having done my research, I came across several mentions of the fact that they won't allow you to renounce unless you proved that you won't owe them any taxes. So you need to do the taxes part.

I just went throught he Russian Consulate site and here is what I found:

Приобретение гражданином Российской Федерации иного гражданства не влечет за собой прекращение гражданства Российской Федерации. Отказ от российского гражданства не требуется, а выход из гражданства Российской Федерации автоматически не происходит.

При поездках в Российскую Федерацию российский гражданин в независимости от наличия у него гражданства иностранного государства обязан въезжать в Россию по действительному заграничному паспорту гражданина Российской Федерации.

I currently do have a valid Russian passport, given the above do you think I should be ok going there without renouncing the citizenship. Although, I have very painful experiences with the Russian bureaucracy I would liket to keep the citizenship just in case. Or you think I am better off renouncing my citizenship? ON the other hand you never know what they can find faults with.. so I guess the safest is to renouce.. just thinking outloud..

Thank you again for your help. I would like the name of the lawyer you are using. I am in New York, not sure if it makes a difference.

kolobed · Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 2:24 am Post subject:

right... so technically, using a US passport to enter or leave russia while retaining a russian citizenship is illegal, according to russian law. so that's why i was saying that the US passport is not worth jack if you're still a citizen of russia. which means... the only legal way to travel back there for us right now is on a valid russian passport. unless i'm misunderstanding something....

honestly, i don't think that i should have much influence on your decision. my situation is fairly simple. i go there without renouncing, i end up in chechnya Smile

you, however, have a much better chance of not having any problems. but once again, it's a risk... maybe a small risk, but still... especially now... the way things are going, with the whole nationalistic garbage and all. last month they shut down all US-based adoption agencies... i don't know what they're going to do next.

let's say you go there for a month with your russian passport as a russian citizen. midway through your vacation, putin decides to close all the borders. while you're there, you are not an american. you are a russian. they have international authority to keep you in their country. from a diplomatic perspective, US will not get involved.... from what i understand.

i say... unless you're planning on moving back there one day... renounce. you're not losing all that much. i'll find out how long it takes and let you know. believe me, i want to go visit like NOW... haven't seen my mom in twelve years. but i'd rather wait a few more months here and pay an american lawyer than wait a few hours in a russian interogation room and pay twice as much in bribes to some drunken douchebag on a powertrip...

lezginka · Just Starting Joined: 04 Jun 2007 Posts: 4

I totally agree with you as well as your sentiments in regards to the situation in Russia. One can never rely on the stability of the situation there. I also did not see my parents in a long while and am dying to go there NOW. But being from the very South (the troubled region as you know), I am more aware of instability of the situation there than anyone else. I guess, the only way is to renounce.. What a shame... I love my country and would love to stay the citizen but they are not making it easy, despite the fact that the population there is shrinking Sad

Thank you again!

kolobed · Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 2:58 am Post subject:

no problem at all. i hope that my input is helpful. and you're right, what a shame..