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newbharry
Frequent Guest
Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 22
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 Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2005 5:50 pm Post subject: about russian's on time |
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ok man.. ww07 .. made a post and stuff.. he sure got flamed.. but i have to say i experienced the same thing with him.. im chinese and ive always been taught to be on time and stuff. if someone arrange 12;00 i'd be there at 11;55. now.. im goin to russia soon but from my experiences with russian people i ve met before and talked to.. it comes to me that they are always late or they ditch. no offense.. my professors.. 2.. in college russian, are often 15~25 minutes late. a russian girl that came to US for foreign exchange said to meet at 2, later never showed up. (this happened twice). this is just the timing. of course i can't just judge by like 3 people but from other experience. natalia said she'd be here after university at 6pm. she showed up at 7;30pm.
I believe this shows how much russian people take "serious" of what they say. Being on time is a good example of taking other people seriously, and what u say seriously.
another example is the university of st petersburg said they will issue my stuff in 1 month. I sent the app in March 02. It's been a month so i wrote them and they say it'll be ready by 4th of May. but now they are sayin im goin to get it this week.. -.- lol should i trust them?
I think the russian gives people "expectations" , i think for them.. it's better to fail the expectation then to give then an unsure answer in the beginning?
About the mail order bride and russian girls gettin visa and stuff.. I notice mail order bride from vietnam, malasia, china, has less "problems" with these issues, and less scamming then the russian brides. who knows.. anyways, pycckaya devushka ochn kracivaya 
About the poker face he was talkin about.. i also have to agree. I saw a documentary in university, and the parent did taught the child to not smile because it's a sign of foolishness? ni ponimayu...
Maybe they dun lie.. but they do play with propoganda and stuff.. my friends in univeristy has also been.. "scammed" by a russian boss. i dun know dun flame me im not generalizing because i haven't met every single russian in my life.
I have an open heart to the russian ppl, i love the language, and i WANT to understand this is why i searched on google and found this site. After all, it is this "delayed " or "unfulfilled promise" of the russians that had killed my great great grandfather!
again no offense dun flame me. just tellin my experience. but i do like their other personality such as being generous and being nice. but im sorta like the person that likes to realli get to know ppl and not just outside "being nice" etc  |
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Paul-Holmes
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1073
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2005 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by Paul-Holmes on Tue May 03, 2005 9:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Vic
Talk Show Host
Joined: 29 Mar 2005
Posts: 298
Location: Moscow, Russian Federation
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2005 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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No offence taken...at all
I agree with you about punctuality of any document related issue. It can be posponed for months.
I also agree about dates. With the girl I was with last, all I do is add +15 minutes to the time she says/agrees to and I get the time she will show up, so I just come 10 minutes late (5 minutes before her). The funny thing is that she ALWAYS came between 10 and 15 minutes late. With other girls here it is usually 10 minutes late.
Please do not call anyone 'Mail Order Brides', there are agencies in any free country that has internet access. I could go and hook up with a girl from the U.S., its nothing special. Keep in mind that you are not 'ordering' anybody. Chances are you will get rejected.
The reason of why it is easier in other countries is mainly because they are more desperate, here they are not. It has nothing to do with the culture, look at Ukraine for instance, the culture is similar but they have more agencies and women looking for men with a population that is 3 to 4 times smaller and a higher % of the relationships from there are more sucessful, they have a habit of jumping at offers. They are desperate, we aren't.
Vic |
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cyndy22
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 1076
Location: massachusetts
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2005 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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First let me say that I for one really appreciate that Paul Homes alias Dr. Fauste is back with his sharp wit here. Paul you make me laugh with your smart comments. Serious.
Secondly re the original question and comments about Russians being more lackadaisical about time- I don't know but it strikes me that 10 or 15 minutes is no big deal in terms of lateness. What's up with that? Punctuality is over rated. |
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newbharry
Frequent Guest
Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 22
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 2:57 am Post subject: |
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| cyndy22 wrote: | First let me say that I for one really appreciate that Paul Homes alias Dr. Fauste is back with his sharp wit here. Paul you make me laugh with your smart comments. Serious.
Secondly re the original question and comments about Russians being more lackadaisical about time- I don't know but it strikes me that 10 or 15 minutes is no big deal in terms of lateness. What's up with that? Punctuality is over rated. |
first im not paul or whatever.
2nd i raised up in my culture to be earlier than appointed time. we're not talkin about 10 or 15 minutes late but never showed up at all. *ditched* and this happened too much that i just have to say something about it. No big deal in terms of lateness? sure there's no big deal for 10 minutes for 1 time but 20 minutes frequently is just not right. it's a professor for goodness sake. or how ive seen as far as 1 hour ~2 and i nearly missed my flight. 2nd, issueing a document 1 month late is not "no big deal" i need to get my visa so i can get out of my country to do other stuff that i need to do. being punctual is a way of being responsible at what you say. the Japanese are punctual in business, and I haven't not yet seen people complain about them being untrustworthy in business and life matters.
i sorta felt cheated and lied, played, when appointed meeting doesn't go through because other doesn't show up at all.
im not here to argue if Russian are trustworthy or not because.. ive read in lotsa places that they are known to be hard to deal with in terms of trust. now im here to understand WHY this is happening. another issue is.. why the Russian are "unpredictable" i read in books and from people near russia that says this about them. i want to understand why.
about mail order bride i dun realli know. peace |
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Paul-Holmes
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1073
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 3:16 am Post subject: |
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Last edited by Paul-Holmes on Tue May 03, 2005 9:53 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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gonzock
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 17 Feb 2005
Posts: 101
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 3:18 am Post subject: |
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Last edited by gonzock on Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:41 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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cyndy22
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 1076
Location: massachusetts
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 3:59 am Post subject: |
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Paul I LOVE YOU. You're humour on this forum is umsurpassed and most definitely unappreciated. You my Canadian darling are the the balls!!  Sorry all, you underpriviledged insecure babies.... |
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greg222
VIP
Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 599
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:25 am Post subject: |
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How come you people are so quick to jump on anyone who has the slightest criticism of Russia or Russians? There are problems in the country and service is the major one. I can't understand why some are so quick and fervent in defending what is, really, indefensible.
Yes, there is a tendency to highlight negatives more than positives, but then that's normal everywhere. Have a look at your local newspaper for instance. See much happy news there? |
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newbharry
Frequent Guest
Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 22
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:33 am Post subject: |
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| Paul Holmes wrote: | Boo hoo hoo. Yeah Chinese and Americans are always on time and Russians are not. Tell that to jokers who suppose to send my luggage to the hotel. Only 8 hours late.
Yeah you are REAL stats guy. Lets see hmmm. 3 Russian people I know are late and one education documents are late. Thus if you take the statisical probablity, then the whole country is late !!!
It is true that Russians wear watches to make sure that they are always late. They look at their watch and say," Better slow down I am on time"
LMAO.
What don't you complain about fat ass bureaucrats who have seniority so they do not worry about getting fired, thus do not give a rat ass.
Have you dealt with the US government? Hmmm.
Put another bag on your head and spray some paint in the bag. |
im "american" yes i have dealt with US government and i have lived in many places. I didn't generalize all russian by 3 russian people. it's alot of experiences that people had said during their stay in Russia and my experience from dealing with much more then 3 russians, i don't think i should just list out everybody right? dun insult me. but it seems weird that i haven't heard this from ppl staying in Japan, or taiwan? But i seriously wish somenoe can explain WHY. plzzz. ive asked russian people themselves.. they said it's their culture.. but why? i mean i understand why Japan's suicide rate is the highest among the world.. and it's their "culture" through their law of government couple hundred years ago. thnx if someone can explain this. much appreciate.
or could this punctual/trust issue be a culture clash between orientals and russian.. cuz most of the guys that post abuot this are orientals? . |
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vettra
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 24 Dec 2004
Posts: 123
Location: Cleveland
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 6:07 am Post subject: |
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| Paul Holmes wrote: | | Simple advice to all your problems. Put a plastic bag over your head. Tie around your neck and breathe deeply. |
| cyndy22 wrote: | | First let me say that I for one really appreciate that Paul Homes alias Dr. Fauste is back with his sharp wit here. Paul you make me laugh with your smart comments. Serious. |
As you see here, assholes like these infest this web site and make it impossible to hold a real discussion, and they drive away real people.
a) Russians being scammers, well that should be obvious to all by now - it's like talking about grass being green. what's the point of discussing it?
b) being late / no-show? that strikes me as strange. They seem to be more punctual than, say, Americans. Can't compare to Chinese - don't recall doing appointments with orientals. Of the countless job interviews I've given, I don't recall a rooskie being noticeably late. Perhaps jobs are taken more seriously there? I suspect newbharry ran into a bad streak.
c) poker faces - there's stuff written about it elsewhere in this web site, but yes of course. Some kinda cultural issue that I can't really fathom. When the Americans beat the Russian hockey team at Lake Placid (~1982), the Russian players were described as being like robots - never showing any joy. Go figure.
| greg222 wrote: | | How come you people are so quick to jump on anyone who has the slightest criticism of Russia or Russians? |
dude, I *hope* you're not like the mass of pricks & bitches that are regulars here! They have no life or friends, because they are crap; so they have turned to the computer for comfort, where they can belch their arrogance while hiding in a closet. We need to bring in support and encouragement for normal people to post words here... perhaps we can crowd them out! Just ignore the bastards. They love Russia, since they are not there - any normal Russian would have bashed their teeth out after the first foul sentence they emanate. They are hated and rejected by
the people around them, so they communicate from a distance. Since Russia is very far, they love Russia and hate the country they are in. it all makes sense
newbharry - you mention cultural clash between orientals and russians. This will be an interesting topic in 50 - 100 years, since Russians are dying. They are facing one of the most severe population implosions of any country today, whereas the neighbor country keeps growing. One day it will be 10 people trying to defend the largest pieces of property, especially from a few billion Chinese. Wow.
Final item: talk about punctuality? Live in Zurich for a while like I did. The Swiss *define punctuality*. Want to rent an apartment, and show up 5 minutes late? --"we don't rent to your kind". There are clocks everywhere,
and everything is on time. The extreme. Switzerland is another country dying out, they have one of the highest %-ages of old people anywhere. |
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Mogsfan
WayToRussified
Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 490
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 6:32 am Post subject: |
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vettra, with all due respect, please read more posts before making rash assumptions. Mr. Holmes is a good guy. The other poster you quoted... the less said the better. Some people here, Mr. Holmes is one, and I am another, are getting fed up with some of the posts/posters here and what they say. Mr. Holmes approaches it differently than I do. Some people here are really sarcastic and display their annoyances with their posts.
I usually respond in a practical way although I could mock and flame as well if I wanted to.
I think a lot of posters were criticizing the generalizations of Russians being tardy regarding appointments and dates.
If there is anything substantial to the original poster's allegations, I don't think it's all that difficult to explain even if I'm only speculating. Although, I don't think the tardiness, if it's a cultural thing, is all that important. That's not the worst flaw to have. Anyway, it could be due to anything from the realization of freedoms to a feeling of being in control. I don't know for sure but I bet back in the day, Russians had a lot of regulations and couldn't be late to superiors etc. As for dates, what's the big deal? It would be convenient if we were all punctual but it's up to each person if they want to be on time or not. I could be wrong but I thought there was a bit of instability in Russia especially regarding modern business customs etc. If there is any punctuality issues culturally speaking, I am sure Russia will deal with it in due time. |
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Paul-Holmes
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1073
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 7:25 am Post subject: |
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Last edited by Paul-Holmes on Tue May 03, 2005 10:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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greg222
VIP
Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 599
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:11 am Post subject: |
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Fair enough, Paul. Although I thought he made it quite clear that he was only basing his observations on a few instances.
I've seen it a few times, though, where someone has made a perfectly valid criticism of Russia and been attacked for it. It just seems strange to me that they could be so blindly defensive of Russia (especially since the people who do so are mainly non-Russians and hence have no patriotic allegiance). |
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newbharry
Frequent Guest
Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 22
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| Paul Holmes wrote: |
I do not bash people who bash Russia per se, but ones that stereotype a whole nation based on small interaction or judgement. For instances, not all American women are fat. Not Australians drink beer and wrestle crocidiles and so forth. It is important to ask a question that is opened ended if you do not know. Harry added a bunch personally negativity and angst to make a stereotypical decision. He got flamed for it. I have flamed in past for my stereotypical response also. It is the forums sarcastic way to say you are being a butthead. Not every thing about Russia is great and not every person I like, but I am not going to label a whole poeple based on some bad experiences. |
[/quote]
- i know what u mean by not stereotypin.. about the obesity in US.. or americans being idiots. not all american are fat, not all americans are idiot BUT the stereotype is true.. in generall are they compare to the world? yes. so dun accuse ppl being stereotype all the time. u have your own schemas.
2nd stop the flaming and grouching at each other. ive seen enough at this forum and it gets guest like me even more confused then what russian are already. I think they are just ppl that's hard to understand. yet nobody has yet to answer my question.... "why is this their culture? poker face, scamming. " plz dun defend nemore about this because.. it's just true. to those that dun believe it to be true just be quiet.
please.. dun flame but just answer the question "why"
usually it starts out by the word "because" |
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