Way to Russia Talk Lounge

e · VIP Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 654

Vic,

In the spirit of El Casey, i'm going to intervene here on the grounds that a rather decent topic and debate has evoled into a personalized pissing contest between you two. I've more or less backed you up and proven Whizz wrong on some of his points. If he doesn't "get it" as he seems to or refuses to see your opinion, then just agree to disagree and let him go. Your expertise and intelligence could be used productively elsewhere. Wink

init6 · Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 2:31 am Post subject:

We really should break off and have a separate discussion about Chechnya, as it is not only interesting, but the story of what's going on there needs to be told - Russians are committing abuses in Chechnya (it's a war, they happen - does NOT justify the abuses, but they DO happen in EVERY war) and Chechen Wahabis are terrorists of the worst sort, getting their jollies by torturing captives and beheading old men (want the video? I have it!). And the video of these gross abuses of fundamental human decency are release by the Chechen terrorists! They're so proud of torturing people that they film damn near everything and release it onto the internet. What sort of sick bastard does that?

Personally, I think it was a BAD idea to take out Maskhadov. He should have been arrested, as I can't imagine the treasure trove of information he would have yielded. On the other hand, the Russians did not kill him. Dudayev was killed by a missile, Maskhadov was shot by his own bodyguards - they had an arrangement that if ever his capture was imminent, they would shoot him - and that's exactly what they did. I have footage of his body, and it was not mangled in any fashion which would suggest a blast weapon of any kind (I will track it down, upload it and provide a link if desired, and that goes for ANY of my Chechen footage).

Back to Khorodkovsy (seriously, MAKE A NEW TOPIC FOR CHECHNYA):

Here's a link to an article in the latest issue of The eXile which gives great information on both sides - the crimes and abuses of Khodorkovsky as well as the government and prosecutors. I had a strange feeling that MosNews had become nothing more than a pro-oligarch propaganda machine and *gasp* surprise, surprise, his clan bought the newspaper. Every editorial is just a "poor Mikhail" bunch of trash from what used to be a GREAT paper. Check it out here:

http://www.exile.ru/2005-June-17/yuck-os_trial.html

Mogsfan · WayToRussified Joined: 03 Nov 2004 Posts: 490

Casey, have you read about the new owners of Exile? Anyway, it's all crap. If you read exile, it is excuse after excuse for anything remotely sounding negative for Mr. Putin. It's also a propaganda machine. It's either pro-Western or pro-Putin propaganda. IS there nothing else that suggests *some* objectivity? Apparently not.

Like what I have said, forever, is isn't possible that both parties could be bad? That is, both are guilty of crimes and wrongdoing! That's what I think while everyone keeps arguing that one side is innocent or just and one is not. Well, I still insist it is one of a collapsed collaboration of the two. You think a corrupt billionaire is going to be that stupid to stay in a country that keeps insisting they are going to fight corruption? C'mon, people, think! Smile

There is more to it. However, I must say, it is not the first time I've read about multiple acquisitions of media outlets so it is very difficult to assess what is reported. All I know for sure, is that the Kremlin has a major influence (and control) over a lot of media in Russia. That cannot be denied. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

init6 · Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:46 am Post subject:

Did you even read the article? Obviously not, because you want to jump on not only the eXile, but me as well, when the article points out dubious circumstances on either side! Rolling Eyes

Besides, what should I read besides the eXile? MosNews' editorials? The Moscow Times?! Laughing

There's no such thing as objectivity, we're humans. But they're a hell of a lot less one-sided than either MosNews or the Moscow Times.

mister_wizzz · VIP Joined: 27 May 2004 Posts: 559