Way to Russia Community and Forum

If you have a question or want to help someone, please, go to
Way to Russia Forum on our Facebook page.
 
We also invite you to join our Facebook community, where you can meet other travelers and read interesting news on topics ranging from visa regulations to culture and music.
 

 

We are currently moving the old forum to Facebook, so what you see below functions as an archive.

If you have a question, please, post it on
Way to Russia Facebook Discussions Page

FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Chat   Log in

Chechnya Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

Way to Russia Talk Lounge Forum Index -> Polls

Should Chechnya: Remain part of the Federation?  58%  [ 18 ] Become Independent?  41%  [ 13 ] Total Votes : 31
Author	Message
init6 WayToRussified Joined: 01 Jun 2005 Posts: 363 Location: Москва, Россия	Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 11:02 pm    Post subject: Well, I shouldn't have called her a stupid bitch, but saying Beslan is acceptable political attack on a military target is idiotic. For the record, I am not a Marxist. I'm not really sure what I am, politically, anymore... As I've said earlier, and I'll say again, if Chechen independence ends the terrorism, then let them be independent. I'm not for forced retention of a culturally unique group of peoples - but I am against the torture and murder of civilians and children! I'm adopting an interesting (for me) stance recently - since I don't live there and I'm no authority on the conflict, I'm gonna start keeping my big trap shut (I doubt I'll be able to, but I'm going to TRY, dammit! ). **EDIT: And I'm assuming that the 1944 date is Zakayev's birth date, while November 13, 2003 is the date when a British judge rejected Russia's extradition request for Zakayev. Investigative Journalism Powers! Engage!
Back to top
renwan Talk Show Host Joined: 29 Oct 2004 Posts: 204	Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 6:02 am    Post subject: All forms of armed struggle are acceptable if the end is to achieve class and national liberation from an opressing force. that being said
Back to top
Only Frequent Guest Joined: 05 Mar 2005 Posts: 48	Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 6:04 am    Post subject: e wrote: I have no idea what that poster means or why they posed in front of it. There wasn't a caption under that photo. Does anyone else know? Poster says "Zakayev we are with you" and has two dates: 23 February 1944 - date of beginning of Stalin's deportation of Chechens, and 13 November 2003 - date of London court ruling against Russian request of extradiction of Zakayev. Hope it helps.
Back to top
init6 WayToRussified Joined: 01 Jun 2005 Posts: 363 Location: Москва, Россия	Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 11:25 pm    Post subject: Renwan, your parallels of Chechnya and occupied Ireland are incredibly disturbing. For one, Ireland is a friggin' island so it's obvious that it belongs to them, and not to the British. The IRA, the PIRA and even the "Real IRA" (a small group of extremists who did not honor the ceasefire) have not gone around murdering school children, beheading old men and young boys, shooting unarmed prisoners of war, or blowing up apartment buildings. The IRA can be classified as terrorists, sure, but they did not attack random civilian targets - they attacked targets that were either military or political (i.e. bombing a hotel while some Royal was visiting there). Furthermore, the IRA almost always phoned in a bomb threat to allow as many people as possible to be evacuated before the detonation. The IRA is not a bunch of Islamist, murderous pieces of Wahabist shit who like killing unarmed prisoners and children. The Chechens of Basayev's gang are.
Back to top
e VIP Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 654	Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 11:59 pm    Post subject: Actually, his connections to Ireland are actually rather sound and intelligent from the pro-Chechen independence angle; perhaps some of the most intelligent i've seen so far. His words from previous posts: Quote: Not having been independent before doesnt make them elss of a state, was Éire(ireland) independent before? NO. does that make the Republic of Éire and the Poblacht na hÉireann less than the brits? A country shall be defined by the piece of land inhabitated by people who are united by blood,language.culture and traditions. and chechenya has none with russia. All forms of armed struggle are acceptable if the end is to achieve class and national liberation from an opressing force. Can't say that he's incorrect there. Russia has been more than a oppresive force in Chechnya throughout the centuries. Theres no way around it. You're also forgetting that the IRA and its offshoots were as ruthless as Bassayev and co before and during Irish independence in 1919, during the Irish Civil War in the early 20s, and of course during the troubles. I would say that Belfast, Omagh, Canary Wharf and Bishopsgate, Central Manchester, or pubs across Brimingham are random civilian targets. Phone call warnings aside, people still died in those attacks.
Back to top
renwan Talk Show Host Joined: 29 Oct 2004 Posts: 204	Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 1:52 am    Post subject: thanx e. well a civil war is a civil war. There is an excellent book you should all read regarding the IRA,well 2. Armed Struggle: The History of the IRA by Richard English[best IRA book ever] and Joe Cahill, a Life in the I.R.A.
Back to top
e VIP Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 654	Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 2:29 am    Post subject: Quote: Armed Struggle: The History of the IRA by Richard English[best IRA book ever] and Joe Cahill, a Life in the I.R.A. I used both of those books for my senior thesis and they both were informative and useful. But thanks for the suggestion anyway. If you are looking for something new to read about the conflict, try reading "A Secret History of the IRA" by Ed Moloney, "Killing Rage" by Eamon Collins, and Gerry Adams's autobiography. And yes, civil wars are always the worst conflicts.
Back to top
Jutrzenkapolska VIP Joined: 16 Sep 2004 Posts: 534	Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 5:25 am    Post subject: In the words of the great Johnny Carson "I would like to say, for the record, that I am in favor of using more American Indians and other minorities in motion pictures, I am against polluting the oceans of the world, I am for every nationality having its own homeland, I am against whacking baby seals on the head, and I am for saving the whales"
Back to top
renwan Talk Show Host Joined: 29 Oct 2004 Posts: 204	Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:55 am    Post subject: readed them all,thanks If I learned anything from my stalin school era,was what Lenin said: Study,Study and Study. I never stopped and never will.
Back to top
Xela VIP Joined: 06 Jul 2005 Posts: 781 Location: Shanghai	Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 10:10 pm    Post subject: No single other conflict in the world captures the attention of British hearts like the Chechnya conflict. Many people see Vanessa Redgrave as a saviour with her work for Chechen seperatists and hold nothing but deep respect and admiration for her, irrespective of her occasional off-centre comments. This may come as bad news to Russians, but it's very true. Now, most people will be familiar with my views on Chechen independence, but regarding the nature of the conflict itself, and after having spoken at length to a former Kremlin serviceman who was directly involved with the Chechen conflict many years ago; I understand it encompasses more than could be written in any book or settled by any debate. Chechnya is a sickness, a disease which is more a syndrome suffered by those involved than a situation that can be fixed overnight by Russian policy. Nevertheless, the Caucasus isn't in the habit of getting told what to do by anybody, certainly are fearful of NO man; and to all you patriotic Russians who disagree, just remember it is the CHECHEN Obshina who you bow to. Either way: Caucasians never lose. But please, people.. When you talk about IRA you are forgetting the dissident republican families which operate completely independantly and whom do not even inform other family members of what they get up to, which has meant there has been hundreds of unaccounted murders, and let me be the first to tell you that these people model themselves more on Basaev than Sinn Fein. Furthermore, the IRA's association with radical Hezbollah has already been proven, with weaponry, techniques and even intelligence being exchanged, so if it's not guilt by assosiation, then it's definately a case of 'what's good for the goose is good for the gander'.. BTW the IRA HAVE killed innocent unarmed people and children and blown up appartment blocks and houses, butchered people like innocent Belfast man Robert McCartney, and as you may have heard yesterday have been disrupting Northern Ireland with unannounced blast bombs; so please forgive me if I'm finding it hard to sympathise with the argument that they have some sense of respect.
Back to top
init6 WayToRussified Joined: 01 Jun 2005 Posts: 363 Location: Москва, Россия	Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 10:30 pm    Post subject: renwan wrote: If I learned anything from my stalin school era,was what Lenin said: Study,Study and Study. I never stopped and never will. That's good advice no matter who you are or what you do!
Back to top
Xela VIP Joined: 06 Jul 2005 Posts: 781 Location: Shanghai	Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 11:15 pm    Post subject: ..Then you should try heeding it, because your knowledge on the IRA is appalling.
Back to top
renwan Talk Show Host Joined: 29 Oct 2004 Posts: 204	Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:30 am    Post subject: I don't understand you,please rephrase the sentence. thanx
Back to top
Jutrzenkapolska VIP Joined: 16 Sep 2004 Posts: 534	Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:54 am    Post subject: Explanation: you said "Study, Study and Study", Casey said "That's good advice" and Xela told Casey "So use it because you clearly haven't studied the IRA"
Back to top
Xela VIP Joined: 06 Jul 2005 Posts: 781 Location: Shanghai	Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 2:27 am    Post subject: Thank you.
Back to top
Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First

	Way to Russia Talk Lounge Forum Index -> Polls	All times are GMT + 3 Hours Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Page 3 of 6