| Do you support the War on Terror? |
| Yes (I don't like terrorists) |
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78% |
[ 11 ] |
| No (I am a terrorist, actually.) lol |
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21% |
[ 3 ] |
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| Total Votes : 14 |
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| Author |
Message |
kolobed
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 142
Location: merkaba
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 Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:02 am Post subject: |
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| Fire_Goddess wrote: |
I think duel citizenship is ok, as long as you arent planning to use your other passport to escape punishment. |
just in your previous post, you made it abundantly clear that you do NOT support dual citizenship. and i quote:
your allegiance belongs to the country you were born in which gave you your opportunities, and unless you renounce your citizenship, you have no business pledging allegiance to a foreign nation. |
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Fire_Goddess
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| kolobed wrote: | | Fire_Goddess wrote: |
I think duel citizenship is ok, as long as you arent planning to use your other passport to escape punishment. |
just in your previous post, you made it abundantly clear that you do NOT support dual citizenship. and i quote:
your allegiance belongs to the country you were born in which gave you your opportunities, and unless you renounce your citizenship, you have no business pledging allegiance to a foreign nation. |
I do not support Jewish Americans having Israeli citizenship and living in the USA, if they consider themselves Jewish, before American. They mine as well just go live in Israel. |
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kolobed
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 142
Location: merkaba
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:07 am Post subject: |
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| Fire_Goddess wrote: | | kolobed wrote: | | Fire_Goddess wrote: |
I think duel citizenship is ok, as long as you arent planning to use your other passport to escape punishment. |
just in your previous post, you made it abundantly clear that you do NOT support dual citizenship. and i quote:
your allegiance belongs to the country you were born in which gave you your opportunities, and unless you renounce your citizenship, you have no business pledging allegiance to a foreign nation. |
I do not support Jewish Americans having Israeli citizenship and living in the USA, if they consider themselves Jewish, before American. They mine as well just go live in Israel. |
you're not going to weasel out of this, man. just give up. that's not what you said. you said that unless a person renounces their [american] citizenship, they have no business being a citizen of another nation. period. is it not what you said? |
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surfguy
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 6979
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:09 am Post subject: |
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| Fire_Goddess wrote: | | kolobed wrote: |
so then you don't believe in dual citizenships? what about all these indians coming to the US, making a great living, saving up and then moving back to india to live like kings?
and it's not about trust... it's about the possibility of the holocaust happening again. who says that it won't? it happened only 60 years ago. whatever happened to learning from history? and besides, you said it yourself in a previous post how easy it would be to lead the people to another holocaust.... |
I think duel citizenship is ok, as long as you arent planning to use your other passport to escape punishment. I however do not believe government employees, or anyone in public office should be holding duel citizenship. Yes its easy to guide people based on fear of the unknown, which is exactly what this war on Terrorism is all about. If people learned from history, they would get it into their brains to stop making the same mistakes, everyone shares in the blame. You shouldnt give people a platform to accuse you, and they should not be accusing based on blind fear. |
yes if people would pay attention then they would fully understand what is going on here...unfortunately a lot of mankind is very competetive and greedy and wants what another has created. Most arab lands suffer greatly and are oppressed...why...because they oppress. Because of this they blame the west for all thier shortcomings and use as as the reason as to why they have not thrived. Palestine is a prime example right now and many there are saying this too. Lebanon has been at civil war for the past 30 years...fighting amongtst them selves...to the point where Syria took over and used Lebanon as a staging point to strike at Israel...well enough is enough...it's all a struggle for land and territory and the extremist have publicly staed that they want to control all of the mediterranian, Spain, and southern Europe...I suggest you look at a globe and compare the trouble spots today with what the Ottoman Empire once was...this is what it is about...then above this is eventually taking over the whole world. |
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Fire_Goddess
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:11 am Post subject: |
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| kolobed wrote: |
you're not going to weasel out of this, man. just give up. that's not what you said. you said that unless a person renounces their [american] citizenship, they have no business being a citizen of another nation. period. is it not what you said? |
I am not trying to weasel out of anything, I am explaining to you what I meant. We were discussing Jews, so I didnt feel I had to keep mentioning jews again and again. Israel is unlike any other nation with ties to the USA, lets take into account all the jews who live in the USA, were born in the USA, yet insisted on getting Israeli citizenship, even though the USA is a better place to live. Lets imagine for a moment that the USA decided to get pissed off at israel and declare war or something of that nature, do you mean to tell me that as Americans, we can trust other Americans who went out of their way to obtain Israeli citizenship yet live in the USA? Are they gonna support the USA or Israel in such a war?? This is a subject of religion, which is why I didnt inclue anyone else from any other country, because it only pertains to religion. |
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kolobed
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 142
Location: merkaba
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:18 am Post subject: |
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| Fire_Goddess wrote: |
I am not trying to weasel out of anything, I am explaining to you what I meant. We were discussing Jews, so I didnt feel I had to keep mentioning jews again and again. Israel is unlike any other nation with ties to the USA, lets take into account all the jews who live in the USA, were born in the USA, yet insisted on getting Israeli citizenship, even though the USA is a better place to live. Lets imagine for a moment that the USA decided to get pissed off at israel and declare war or something of that nature, do you mean to tell me that as Americans, we can trust other Americans who went out of their way to obtain Israeli citizenship yet live in the USA? Are they gonna support the USA or Israel in such a war?? This is a subject of religion, which is why I didnt inclue anyone else from any other country, because it only pertains to religion. |
oh.. now THAT is a completely different, and very interesting topic. however, the US relationship with israel is very unlikely to go sour. instead, think about all the russians that hold dual citizenships. and now think about the current US-russia relationship. i think you should concern yourself with that before you even think about questioning allegiance of american jews to the US.
also... it has little to do with religion. most jewish americans who make the aliyah are secular and non-religious. it is a matter of a sense of belonging and tradition. which could be said about any immigrant, not just a jew. |
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surfguy
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 6979
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:21 am Post subject: |
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| subject of religion? THis happened in WWII and really in all wars...would you trust any israeli that resides here. Oh and to respond to the earlier post...no this is not a anti Muslim/arab site and I don't like it that way either. I am opposed to terrorist. I also try to deal with people individually...stereotypical anything are what cast the ills in our world. |
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Fire_Goddess
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:22 am Post subject: |
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| kolobed wrote: |
oh.. now THAT is a completely different, and very interesting topic. however, the US relationship with israel is very unlikely to go sour. instead, think about all the russians that hold dual citizenships. and now think about the current US-russia relationship. i think you should concern yourself with that before you even think about questioning allegiance of american jews to the US. |
Russians can be deported if they werent born here, American born jews who hold Israeli passports, can not. Personally I think there is no good reason for an American Jew to want Israeli nationality, I think its selfish, and it just makes it harder for people who are actually being victimized to move to Israel, because its overcrowded with people who dont need to be there yet insist on it anyway. Leave Israel for people who need it, not people who want it. If someone formed an all Christian country tomorrow, I wouldnt go swear allegiance to it, hell I probably wouldnt even identify with it. |
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surfguy
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 6979
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:23 am Post subject: |
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| Before the Russian and Israeli relationship with the US we should be more concerned with Mexico |
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Fire_Goddess
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:25 am Post subject: |
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| surfguy wrote: | | Before the Russian and Israeli relationship with the US we should be more concerned with Mexico |
No we are too busy with our noses in oil, rather than focusing on alternative fuels. So bringing up the whole illegal alien thing, is furthest on the list of things this government plans to do anything about. |
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surfguy
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 6979
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:27 am Post subject: |
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| there is obviously very anti Israeli sentiment coming from you Fire G. do you know that Israel is a very religiously tolerant country...especially when compared to it's neigbors...you should go to there if you haven't been. I hope to go with in the next couple of years...would love to see Jeruselem |
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surfguy
Lounge Wizard
Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 6979
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:28 am Post subject: |
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| Fire_Goddess wrote: | | surfguy wrote: | | Before the Russian and Israeli relationship with the US we should be more concerned with Mexico |
No we are too busy with our noses in oil, rather than focusing on alternative fuels. So bringing up the whole illegal alien thing, is furthest on the list of things this government plans to do anything about. |
yes but I was thinking about us as individuals shouold be concerned |
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Fire_Goddess
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:31 am Post subject: |
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| surfguy wrote: | | there is obviously very anti Israeli sentiment coming from you Fire G. do you know that Israel is a very religiously tolerant country...especially when compared to it's neigbors...you should go to there if you haven't been. I hope to go with in the next couple of years...would love to see Jeruselem |
You pretend like Palestinians never existed in the region, and matter very little as human beings. I have never pretended that jews didnt exist in the region or acted as if they meant very little as human beings. |
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kolobed
Lounge Lizard
Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 142
Location: merkaba
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:31 am Post subject: |
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| Fire_Goddess wrote: | | kolobed wrote: |
oh.. now THAT is a completely different, and very interesting topic. however, the US relationship with israel is very unlikely to go sour. instead, think about all the russians that hold dual citizenships. and now think about the current US-russia relationship. i think you should concern yourself with that before you even think about questioning allegiance of american jews to the US. |
Russians can be deported if they werent born here, American born jews who hold Israeli passports, can not. Personally I think there is no good reason for an American Jew to want Israeli nationality, I think its selfish, and it just makes it harder for people who are actually being victimized to move to Israel, because its overcrowded with people who dont need to be there yet insist on it anyway. Leave Israel for people who need it, not people who want it. If someone formed an all Christian country tomorrow, I wouldnt go swear allegiance to it, hell I probably wouldnt even identify with it. |
1. ummm, no. russians that hold american citizenships as well as russian citizenships cannot be legally deported, no matter where they were born. where did you get that from?
2. israel is not overcrowded, in fact, there are numerous programs, initiated by israel that concentrate on bringing youth from the diaspora in hopes of getting them to stay. they want more jews in israel. in fact, they need more jews in israel.
you are grossly misinformed. |
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Fire_Goddess
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:34 am Post subject: |
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| surfguy wrote: |
yes but I was thinking about us as individuals shouold be concerned |
There is obviously a propaganda war which tries to vilify anyone who doesnt support illegals, and call them anti immigrants and even go as far as to label them racists. What is a common citizen to do when their elected officials refuse to act in the best interests of the community and would rather cater to the PC crowd, and their idea of a "perfect world". |
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