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Joseph Stalin Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, ... 23, 24, 25  Next

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Author	Message
surfguy Lounge Wizard Joined: 13 Apr 2006 Posts: 6979	Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 8:21 pm    Post subject: he was no different than hitler, castro, chavez, kim jun ill, mao te sung...etc etc...
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Rimski Frequent Guest Joined: 12 Sep 2007 Posts: 58	Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Joseph Stalin Yuri's Girl wrote: Do you think he helped the country along or was it just a reign of terror? Yes he did for the country. He lead the Soviet Uninon to become a military superpower. The Soviet Union wasn't an economic superpower because of communism ideology. Communism, it's fact now, doesn't support economic development.... I'd like to recall that he also freed Europe from the nazis. It's the Red Army (of "the brutal man") that took Berlin and not the western "democratic" forces. The Stalingrad battle was the true one turn of the WWII with the defeat of the 6th german army. Western Media always speak about the "D" Day but it's not the american and the british that have beaten Nazi Germany. They have only contributed to... Don't forget it! Of course it was a reign of terror. Stalin was brutal. We cannot approve the political oppression under hisreign but... there is an explanation to what lead Russia to ommunism... I apologize for my english. I'm a beginner.... Last edited by Rimski on Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:22 pm; edited 3 times in total
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StephenB. VIP Joined: 18 Aug 2007 Posts: 807	Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 7:37 pm    Post subject: The explanation that lead to Stalin's brutality was that the guy was insane...and created his own ideology of communism that didn't reflect Marx or Engels. If you have to force people to follow and ideology through terror than it's not good...it's evil. Nothing good came out of Communism in Russia...what is left are shattered suspecious people who don't trust each other or any other form of gov't. Capitalism will work, but it won't work if you still have the mentally of a communist...stealing, mistrust, pernicious behaviors and corrupt politicians.
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raggedclaw Frequent Guest Joined: 22 Jul 2005 Posts: 18	Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 7:39 pm    Post subject: Rimski -- you are right, of course. And, that is from an American. Only a Stalin could defeat Germany. As Stalin very well knew, we sat on our arses, biding our time, letting the Soviet army and Russian population take the full force of the Nazi war machine -- if the Soviets won, well good; if the Nazis eventually won, well at least they'd be weakened for us to fight. Then, after Berlin fell, Stalin moved his army from Europe to China where the Red Army scored a victory in one of history's most important battles -- the Red Army defeated the Japanese in China with almost no casualties and taking out the last viable Japanese military force. Many historians -- the British War Museum to note one -- consider the Soviet defeat of the Japanese army in China as more likely to have prompted the Japanese surrender than the US's use of the atomic bomb. It is a battle that is not mentioned in US public schools, or even in most US university history courses. Then Patton, with a huge standing army (with nuclear weapons) sitting in Europe, spouts off that we should go ahead and take out the Commies. Then, look back at all of the weapons outside the Armory in the Kremlin (the cannon inscriptions are in French, Italian, German, etc., with the display intending to remind that many come, but none conquer). Is it any wonder that Stalin was a little "paranoid?" Look how militaristic and warmongering the US has become after suffering a fairly small blow on 9/11. Just imagine how we would react if we had been invaded as many times as Russia/Soviet Union had been invaded. What if we had lost 30 million lives on 9/11 and had our entire industrial base smashed? Reckon we might have been a little paranoid? Reckon we might be doing things such as Guantanamo on a massively larger scale, i.e., the purges of Stalin. Damn people, try to put yourselves in their shoes.
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Rimski Frequent Guest Joined: 12 Sep 2007 Posts: 58	Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 12:59 pm    Post subject: StephenB. wrote: If you have to force people to follow and ideology through terror than it's not good...it's evil. What did the US, the leader of "the free world", to the Vietnam people and what are they doing now to the Iraqi people? Since the US intervention in 2003 more than 650 000 (according to american sources) iraqies died because of the civil war. To spread democracy with weapons is not evil? Last edited by Rimski on Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:23 pm; edited 8 times in total
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surfguy Lounge Wizard Joined: 13 Apr 2006 Posts: 6979	Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 8:15 pm    Post subject: Rimski wrote: StephenB. wrote: If you have to force people to follow and ideology through terror than it's not good...it's evil. What did the US, the leader of "the free world", to the Vietnam people and to the Iraqi people today? Since the US intervention in 2003 more than 650 000 iraqies died because of the civil war. To spread democracy with weapons is not evil? very poor examples...It's funny because Vietnam today is becomming more and more a free market society. Also how many deaths there were a result of the North Vietnamese...look to Cambodia too...how many of thier own people were killed at the hands of the Kamer Ruge (sorry for the spelling) Also Iraq is not about spreading democracy...we all know this. Look at Palestine right now...Palestinians were killing Palestinians for power...just last month! So I suppose that was the USA who was doing that? Sorry not buying what you are saying Rimski
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RusskiCanadian23 Lounge Wizard Joined: 27 Mar 2007 Posts: 1104 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada/Ванкувер, Британская Колумбия, Канада	Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 9:43 pm    Post subject: surfguy wrote: Rimski wrote: StephenB. wrote: If you have to force people to follow and ideology through terror than it's not good...it's evil. What did the US, the leader of "the free world", to the Vietnam people and to the Iraqi people today? Since the US intervention in 2003 more than 650 000 iraqies died because of the civil war. To spread democracy with weapons is not evil? very poor examples...It's funny because Vietnam today is becomming more and more a free market society. Also how many deaths there were a result of the North Vietnamese...look to Cambodia too...how many of thier own people were killed at the hands of the Kamer Ruge (sorry for the spelling) Also Iraq is not about spreading democracy...we all know this. Look at Palestine right now...Palestinians were killing Palestinians for power...just last month! So I suppose that was the USA who was doing that? Sorry not buying what you are saying Rimski No, that would be Israel. With American weapons. With an army trained by American instructors. But NOT America. Nope. America are the good guys. Always. Even in Star Wars, all the bad guys had British accents, and the good guys were played by Harrison Ford and spoke American English... Talk about PROPAGANDA!
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surfguy Lounge Wizard Joined: 13 Apr 2006 Posts: 6979	Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 9:48 pm    Post subject: Israel...nope sorry...We are talking the government take over that happened in Palestine...it was the pro west gov that got over thrown...wasn't due to Israel Russkii
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StephenB. VIP Joined: 18 Aug 2007 Posts: 807	Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:46 am    Post subject: Rimski wrote: StephenB. wrote: If you have to force people to follow and ideology through terror than it's not good...it's evil. What did the US, the leader of "the free world", to the Vietnam people and to the Iraqi people today? Since the US intervention in 2003 more than 650 000 iraqies died because of the civil war. To spread democracy with weapons is not evil? So you are saying that if we hadn't taken out Saddam, Iraq would be a peaceful country? Who invaded Kuwait? Who fought a ten year war with Iran? There were more people killed in that war than the civil war in Iraq. A civil war was bound to happen anyway...you have three different groups that don't like each other...Sunni's, Shiites and Kurds...look of what Saddam was doing before he was taken down by the USA....killing Shiites in the South of Iraq and planning another attack on the Kurdish population in the North. The Kurds are very happy that the Americans are in Iraq..they have been terrorized by this crazy man for almost twenty years..."Spreading communism in the East was not evil???"
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yorbcbud Lounge Wizard Joined: 17 Feb 2006 Posts: 4903 Location: Сорренто, Британская Колумбия, Канада	Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 5:01 am    Post subject: RusskiCanadian23 wrote: surfguy wrote: Rimski wrote: StephenB. wrote: If you have to force people to follow and ideology through terror than it's not good...it's evil. What did the US, the leader of "the free world", to the Vietnam people and to the Iraqi people today? Since the US intervention in 2003 more than 650 000 iraqies died because of the civil war. To spread democracy with weapons is not evil? very poor examples...It's funny because Vietnam today is becomming more and more a free market society. Also how many deaths there were a result of the North Vietnamese...look to Cambodia too...how many of thier own people were killed at the hands of the Kamer Ruge (sorry for the spelling) Also Iraq is not about spreading democracy...we all know this. Look at Palestine right now...Palestinians were killing Palestinians for power...just last month! So I suppose that was the USA who was doing that? Sorry not buying what you are saying Rimski No, that would be Israel. With American weapons. With an army trained by American instructors. But NOT America. Nope. America are the good guys. Always. Even in Star Wars, all the bad guys had British accents, and the good guys were played by Harrison Ford and spoke American English... Talk about PROPAGANDA! I think a better example would be the invasion of Lebanon, wouldn't it. That one had "Bush" written all over it.
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surfguy Lounge Wizard Joined: 13 Apr 2006 Posts: 6979	Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 5:42 am    Post subject: yorbcbud wrote: RusskiCanadian23 wrote: surfguy wrote: Rimski wrote: StephenB. wrote: If you have to force people to follow and ideology through terror than it's not good...it's evil. What did the US, the leader of "the free world", to the Vietnam people and to the Iraqi people today? Since the US intervention in 2003 more than 650 000 iraqies died because of the civil war. To spread democracy with weapons is not evil? very poor examples...It's funny because Vietnam today is becomming more and more a free market society. Also how many deaths there were a result of the North Vietnamese...look to Cambodia too...how many of thier own people were killed at the hands of the Kamer Ruge (sorry for the spelling) Also Iraq is not about spreading democracy...we all know this. Look at Palestine right now...Palestinians were killing Palestinians for power...just last month! So I suppose that was the USA who was doing that? Sorry not buying what you are saying Rimski No, that would be Israel. With American weapons. With an army trained by American instructors. But NOT America. Nope. America are the good guys. Always. Even in Star Wars, all the bad guys had British accents, and the good guys were played by Harrison Ford and spoke American English... Talk about PROPAGANDA! I think a better example would be the invasion of Lebanon, wouldn't it. That one had "Bush" written all over it. hmmm...how so...what is the evidence?
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mister_wizzz VIP Joined: 27 May 2004 Posts: 582	Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:29 pm    Post subject: '' Last edited by mister_wizzz on Tue Sep 18, 2007 2:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Rimski Frequent Guest Joined: 12 Sep 2007 Posts: 58	Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:35 pm    Post subject: raggedclaw wrote: Many historians -- the British War Museum to note one -- consider the Soviet defeat of the Japanese army in China as more likely to have prompted the Japanese surrender than the US's use of the atomic bomb. There is no proof, but it's not impossible that the US drop the atomic bomb to prevent the invasion of Japan by the soviet army. Oh! they have saved Japan from communism. So Japan should thanks the US for Hiroshima and Nagasaki [Joke]. surfguy wrote: very poor examples... It's funny because Vietnam today is becomming more and more a free market society. Also how many deaths there were a result of the North Vietnamese... Now it's the will of Vietnam to become a free market society. Sorry, but i don't think that the north vietnamese killed more people than the 7 million tones of american bombs. 2 millions of vietnamese died during the Vietnam war, a useless war carried out by " Nice America." A poor example. The Condor operation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor US have provided support to south america military dictatorships in the seventies helping them to kill democratic opponents. The "free World" is so nice! Thanks to US for supporting Pinochet and Co. Thank you Nice America A poor example too. surfguy wrote: Also Iraq is not about spreading democracy...we all know this. Sorry i've forgotten. They came for oil! It's a very good reason, they have all the rights to do so. Thanks to the US for the fall of Saddam and the civil war in Iraq with 700 000 deaths. It's true that communism isn't a perfect ideology but don't tell us that "the free World" is made of angels. Stalin died more than 50 years ago. People are still dying massively and it's not because of communism! Last edited by Rimski on Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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mister_wizzz VIP Joined: 27 May 2004 Posts: 582	Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 2:21 pm    Post subject: mister_wizzz wrote: Let's say the truth : NAzi Germany and Soviet Union were 2 horrible monsters, it was the 2 only political regime based on concentration camps. By the way it is not a secret Stalin and Hitler had a great admiration for each other, and I remind that the Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union were the best friends until Germany attacked in 1941. - between WWI and WWII, the Soviet Union and Germany had a military cooperation, Germany sold war technology in exchange of raw materials which allowed Germany to rearm. - the non agression pact in 1938 which let Hitler starting his war on the west front knowing he shouln't have to fight on the east side. - the agreement between the Soviet Union and the Nazi germany to share Poland in 1939 and the murder of 22500 polish officers in Katyn... The SOviet Union became automatically an allie of the west just because Hitler attacked first. But just imagine if the Soviet Union had attacked Germany first ? Be sure that USA would have helped Germany (like USA helped Franco in the Spanish Civil war) and we (the west) would probably be thankful for the sacrifice of the Wermacht. For me, there was no difference between Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union during the Stalin' period, both were absolute Evil.
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gomer WayToRussified Joined: 30 Mar 2007 Posts: 445	Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 2:50 pm    Post subject: Rimski wrote: There is no proof, but it's not impossible that the US drop the atomic bomb to prevent the invasion of Japan by the soviet army. Oh! they have saved Japan from communism. So Japan should thanks the US for Hiroshima and Nagasaki [Joke]. There is a theory that Japan surrendered to the U.S. because Japan thought they would fare better in a post-WWII world under U.S. occupation than under Soviet Union occupation. Japan chose what it considered to be the lesser of two evils. Rimski wrote: US have provided support to south america military dictatorships in the seventies helping them to kill democratic opponents. The "free World" is so nice! Thanks to US for supporting Pinochet and Co . I think a U.S. Military Officer once said," Yeah, **** a SOB, but he's our SOB".
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