Way to Russia Talk Lounge

_Stas_ · Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 7:15 am Post subject: Another draft question

Hello,

First a few words about my case. I left Russia for Canada when I was about 13 years old and have never been back since. I do have the 'Zagranichnyj' passport with the 'departed for permanent residency' stamp in it. I would like to visit Russia and probably stay there for some time but I am still 25 years old and hence liable for the draft.

I realize that this question has been covered before and I've been reading some of the posts on it but there seems to be a divergence of opinions on the issue. Some people think that if you don't have the internal passport with 'propiska' in it, and if you register with a Russian embassy in your country of residence, then you're fine. Others are still leery of going there regardless. So is there any consensus and am I missing something or is there not? Because if some people think that there is a decent chance that you might be drafted then going there is probably not worth the risk.

goDutch · Frequent Guest Joined: 14 Jun 2007 Posts: 64

Conscription in Russia is made by Voenkomats. If you live in Russia, then you are registered in your local Voenkomat. You are their "client" and they will chase you. If you 'departed for permanent residency' , then you are "invisible" for Voenkomats, and the standard conscription procedure does not work.

I've never heard that a person permanently living abroad was drafted in Russia. However, the law does not say that this is not possible. As you noticed, you are still liable for the draft. Read the post by dmitristuckinus "Поставлен на Учет":
http://www.waytorussia.net/TalkLounge/viewtopic.php?p=79473#79473
According to Article 1, if you are not liable for the draft, then you will not be registered. But not the other way around.

It is very difficult to say what is actually the chance for you to be drafted. It looks negligibly small, but in principle it can be there.

_Stas_ · Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 2:13 am Post subject:

Thanks goDutch,

I was wondering though, if I go to Russia for more than a year with intention to work there, then I'll obviously need to rent an apartment. Would my 'Zagranichnyj' passport suffice and wold I need to get some sort of a 'propiska'? Because if I do, then I'll become "visible" to Voenkomat.

goDutch · Frequent Guest Joined: 14 Jun 2007 Posts: 64

Stas, you have to register after 90 days. The registration rules are there:

http://base.consultant.ru/cons/cgi/online.cgi?req=doc;base=LAW;n=50881;fld=134;dst=100015;div=LAW

You should register "по месту пребывания", because the registration "по месту жительства" means that you loose your status as a person permanently living abroad. Then, you should have an ID - "документ, удостоверяющий личность". The law says: "Паспорт обязаны иметь все граждане Российской Федерации, достигшие 14-летнего возраста и проживающие на территории Российской Федерации". In theory, your stay in Russia can be interpreted as "пребывание". And since it is not "проживание", then you are not obliged to have the domestic passport and your zagranichnyi passport will be a valid ID.

Now, read article 9 in "II. Регистрация граждан по месту пребывания". It says that "граждане, прибывшие для временного проживания ...". As you see, "пребывание" and "проживание" can also be interpreted as the same thing. In this case they will ask for your domestic passport. And getting the domestic passport involves registration in a Voenkomat.

WayToRussia · Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 4:23 am Post subject:

... and I read somewhere that if you have this stamp (PMZh one - permanent place of residency abroad), then you're not liable for the army service in Russia... it should be in the law somewhere, but I'm pretty sure.

Actually, you're lucky you got it when you were 13, cause if you tried to get it in 18, they'd want permission from your Voenkomat to do it (and they wouldn't give it to you of course). But now it seems like you're all set...

If you want to be really really invisible you can also register at some other apartment, not the one you're renting.

_Stas_ · Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:42 am Post subject:

Many thanks for your help goDutch. It appears then that my trip will have to wait.

_Stas_ · Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:53 am Post subject:

WayToRussia · Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 3:21 pm Post subject:

Well, then how do foreigners who stay in Russia longer than 90 days register their visas? They don't get a Russian passport. And by the way, there's no law that says getting a Russian passport requires voenkomat. I got my renewed a few years ago -- didn't have to go there or bring any papers. They might sometimes ask you to, but there's no law that makes you do it.

However, if you register on your Russian passport, they will inform voenkomat. So what I'd do is just get temporary registration every 90 days and keep your PMZh intact.

goDutch · Frequent Guest Joined: 14 Jun 2007 Posts: 64

Admin, how to register foreigners is a different story. Russian citizens living in Russia are obliged to have a domestic passport. Domestic passports contain, in particular, the following records:

- о регистрации гражданина по месту жительства и снятии его с регистрационного учета соответствующими органами регистрационного учета;
- об отношении к воинской обязанности граждан, достигших 18 летнего возраста;

You do not need to go to Voenkomat when you renew your passport, because all the information is in your old passport. They just copy it.